The Over 40 Crowd

[AMck]

Kat, thinking of you and sending lots of PMA. Hang in there!

Anna

[Kat]

Debra - nice to hear from you, was thinking about you yesterday, and you are welcome here anytime, you know that.
Having conversations in my head all the time, driving myself mad. DH is v quiet on the subject. All we can do is wait....argggghhhhh!!!
Kat xx

[lara]

Hi, I'm 43 nearly 44 and I'm in London. Over here is hard because the HFEA which dictates the law around fertility treatment says you can't put more than 3 embryos back at once, and only 2 if you're under 40 or have done PGS (screening).
I've had two missed miscarriages this year, one at 10 weeks and one at 12 weeks, and I went into the hospital for my nuchal scan, all happy and hopeful, having already had a scan at 8 weeks with a heartbeat, and there it was dead on the screen. Then had to wait 2 or 3 days to have it scraped out. Fun.
I've been reading the messages in this, my age group, trying to understand what you're all doing because in the UK we use different drugs etc.
Because of the law here I'm considering doing GIFT, where sperm and eggs are put into the fallopian tubes separately which gets around the law and increases your chances of pregnancy. But beware, the chances of miscarriage at my age are 50%. For this reason, and because of my missed miscarriages, I've been considering screening to screen out the aneuploidy chromosomes which cause the miscarriages.
I wish I could have treatment in the States and have the whole lot of embryos put back.

[AMck]

Hi Lara and welcome to the thread. Sorry to read about your experiences so far. There are lots of ladies here from the UK so hopefully we will be able to offer advice and support from a UK view.
I am 42 and am down regging at the moment inprep for IVF. It is difficult to find much info on over 40 treatments. The truth about the docs is that they reallly don't know how we are going to respond to tmt as we are all so different.
Anyway you found us! Loads of support and advice coming your way, just ask away and I'm sure someone will be able to help.

Good luck

Anna

[Kat]

Hi Lara, and welcome.
Sorry to hear about your miscarriages, sounds like a good idea to have the screening you mention if it can help.
I just read a bit about GIFT, didn't know anything about it before. Are there other advantages apart from the possibility of having more than 2 or 3 embryos? How many eggs would they put in?
I'm in the UK too but went to Spain for tmt with donor eggs as the waiting lists over here are long to say the least. We had 2 embryos put back but if our 3rd had been high enough quality we would have had that one put in too. They would not do more than 3 there either I don't think.
As Anna says, ask any questions, vent your anger/frustration on here, that's what we're here for!
Take care
Love
Kat xx

[Kat]

Thought I'd put this on again before it gets lost

Kat - Fresh/donor cycle end Oct, 2ww, test Tues 8th Nov
Nuala - fresh cycle, late Oct.
BigJ - TESE/donor egg cycle in Kiev in November.
Caroline - November FET postponed because my Mum is seriously ill
Amfy - started downregging Thurs 5th Oct
Anna - Down reg inj 3rd Nov, waiting for AF and cyst drain
JackieT - start downregging 2/11 for FET
Heather - FET November sometime
Randa - Natural BDing until Jan

Kat xx

[AMck]

Hi all

Am waiting for AF before I can have a cyst drained and start stimming. Any ideas on how to encourage her to appear? Is it true that a little bit of jiggy with DH will help?

Does anyone know if you are allowed to jiggy when you have had a prostap jab? Is it dangerous to get pregnant with those drugs in your system? (miracles can happen!)

Am spending far too long each day browsing this fab site. Beginning to get addicted....HELP!

Good luck to all

Anna

[Kat]

Hi Anna, I too am becoming addicted (always happens when I am having tmt) Sorry, don't have any ways of making af appear, though on a few occasions she has appeared the morning after sex. May be just a coincidence though.
Anyone got any plans for fireworks? We are going round some friends who always have a bonfire and do food and then everyone else brings fireworks. Boys being boys it has turned into a competition to see who can bring the biggest and loudest (and most expensive) firework - all good fun and possibly slightly dangerous! They have a big garden though so no too near anyone else's house. Just hoping the rain holds off until a bit later on.
Speak later
Kat xx

[lara]

Hi Kat and Anna,
Thanks for your messages.
I think because I read about someone harvesting eggs which would be pointless in the uk as you can't put more than 2/3 back anyway that everyone was in the US! Jumping to conclusions there.
About GIFT: A read about Professor Craft (who did the first test tube baby) doing GIFT for older women, putting more gametes back to up the chances, and he's doubled the stats for my age group through this process. I went to his clinic and discussed my options with one of his doctors who was very informative and helpful. There is evidence to suggest that embryos survive better in-vivo than in-vitro, so that the sooner you put either gametes or embryos into the body the better their chances of survival, but this evidence is not generally published because it's difficult to collect it from humans (it has been proved with cows!). However, GIFT involves a hole in the stomach (laparoscopy) and is much more expensive, so isn't generally practiced any more. Also, you have to have at least one healthy tube, and no problems with the sperm.
An alternative for older women is to go to Cyprus or Dubai and have egg collection, then have all the embryos put back which is allowed there. Spain is Catholic, so, like Italy, would be if anything more conservative than UK not less. Professor Craft flies over-40s to Cyprus for this purpose. however, if you're not producing more than three healthy embryos anyway, then of course it's not relevant or helpful to be able to put more back at one time.
You're all very brave and encouraging - it's amazing to find these people struggling with this hugely emotive topic. Thanks for everything you've said to encourage me, and the best of luck with it all.
By the way, last time I was pregnant I had no sore bosoms, no sickness, no tiredness, and couldn't face doing a test so went on holiday sure I wasn't pregnant....but I was! So don't jump to conclusions Kat.
Lara x

[Chinamiff]

Dancola
Sorry, my reply is a bit late, maybe you have already left for China.
Chinese for hello is ni hao (pronounced nee how)
Thanks is xie xie (Sheer, sheer)

Amck
I had to tell my bosses because i need to go back to the UK for the treatment. I also had to turn down a great promotion last month and tell the top boss of the company the true situation (9000 employees and I would have been the highest level women). On one side I am lucky because they have supported me, but I think I have committed career suicide which is very unfortunate. My dp is the one who will stay at home and be house husband, but I dont think my bosses believe that, they are a little old fashioned in their family unit views.

Anyway, I have crashed your thread 2 times now, so i better get off.

wish you all the very best,
Caroline, good luck

[Kat]

Hi all
How's everyone doing? Wet and windy Sunday morning here, don't think I'll set foot outside the door. The rain held off for the firework party last night though. Excellent fun.

Lara - would you go overseas then do you think?
Anna - did af appear yet?
Chinamiff - feel free to pop in here anytime - you're always welcome

Everyone else, have a good day. I am getting just a little nervous (a little?!) it being very nearly Monday which is very nearly Tuesday and therefore test day! I have bought the dreaded hpt (2-pack) and I will do one Monday night. I can't do the first one Tues morning, I need time to recover from the result, whatever it may be, before I face the world.

Kat - Fresh/donor cycle end Oct, 2ww, test Tues 8th Nov
Nuala - fresh cycle, late Oct.
BigJ - TESE/donor egg cycle in Kiev in November.
Caroline - November FET postponed because my Mum is seriously ill
Amfy - started downregging Thurs 5th Oct
Anna - Down reg inj 3rd Nov, waiting for AF and cyst drain
JackieT - start downregging 2/11 for FET
Heather - FET November sometime
Randa - Natural BDing until Jan

Kat xx

[AMck]

Hello to all

DH is off playing football, so here I am again glued to the screen!
There is absolutely no sign of AF. Typical. Mind you last time I had a down reg jab I had to wait 33 days. It will probably be the same again this time. Who knows?

Lara if you do decide to go overseas I would love to read about your experience. It maybe something we would do too.

Caroline, thinking of you and hoping all is Ok. My father died suddenly in July, I was in the middle of a down reg (That didn't work )at the time.
Be kind to yourself and let others be kind to you.

Kat, you must be counting the hours now. Good luck, good luck, good luck!!

PMA to all

Anna

[lara]

Going abroad is an option, but I need to find out whether out of the 10 embryos I had last time more than three would have been put back on day 3 had I not continued to the blastocyst stage, when only 2 were put back. If you don't have more than 3 good embryos anyway there's no point in going abroad. The trouble is, once you reach blastocyst stage only 2 can be transferred, but if there are any left for freezing it's not great because they've begun hatching so the outer layer is less protective against the effects of cryo-preservation.
If you have PGS (screening) for aneuploidy chromosomes you can only have 2 embryos transferred at any age, including over-40s, yet there are never any for freezing because once they've biopsied the embryos their shell is damaged, a bit like assisted hatching, so they're no good for freezing either. However, if you're having IVF in the UK and you produce a good number of embryos and you're over 40, screening is a good option because you're going to select the embryos that aren't going to miscarry due to chromosomal problems, and if you get the screening done at a good clinic there's no damage to the embryos done by the process.
I think GIFT has better results than IVF for over-40s because a) you can put as many gametes back as you like and b) embryos survive better in the body than in the tube so the sooner everything's shoved back in the better. However, most over-40s don't have the GIFT option because they're not in London. I worked out that GIFT here would cost not much less than IVF abroad, so the money's not the issue (about £7k inc. of drugs etc., ie very expensive!)
Do most of you stay with the same clinic all the time or do you move around? I feel strange about leaving my clinic because they've been so good to me and have got me pregnant twice, so they know what drugs to use and how much etc etc. Also, it's part of a hospital so everything's kind of efficient and on-hand. Going to a clinic in Harley St is weird because it's a kind of house that's been converted.
Good luck with the test, Kat, god I feel nervous just thinking about it. Crossing everything!
Lara

[Kat]

Hi

Starting to get v nervous now! Some AF cramps this afternoon, had them Thurs & Fri afternoon too but not Sat or maybe I just didn't notice. Plus I am inserting a pessary at 2pm each day so maybe this is why they come in the afternoon. Who knows.

Have been looking round the boards to try to reassure myself and there are some people who had absolutely no symptoms and some had af pain badly and then got a +ve. I have had sore boobs today a bit so I am clinging to that as as good sign. Could be the medication though. Driving myself mad ... it's not as if I haven't been here before.

Lara - I stayed with the same clinic for 6 tries, I think mainly because I like to know where I am and feel comfortable. No. 7 was in Barcelona as you know. Some people change around, whatever you're comfortable with I suppose.

Take care all and wish me luck!
Kat xx

[CarolineP]

Kat

I had exactly the same AF symptons for my 1st three -ive results as my last +ive result.

All my treatments and symptons were the same in every case and the only difference in the last treatment was I was signed off work sick for the whole 2ww. I have been told by the medical professionals that this is a complete coincidence!

My thoughts and prays are with you and I wish you the very best of luck.

CarolineP