Over 40 preg after IVF failure?

[maggie68]

Hi Ladies, I wonder if anybody out there can share their successful natural pregnancy story after fialed IVF cycles. I am just about to fail my 2nd IVF attempt . Don't know exactly what we will do next. Here is my short preg. history:
1. had been very easy to get preg. on our own (before 9/2005 IVF).
2. 5 m/c (2002, 2004, 2005), 1 confirmed trisomy 21.
3. 2 IVF attempts. Both times as a poor responder. 1st attempt 9/2005 at 39, only 4 follicles big enough for retrevial, 3 eggs, 2 fertilized, PGD both abnormal chromosomes, no transfer. 2nd attempt at 40, 9/2006 using flare protocol (the strongest one as Dr said), only 3 follicles big enough for retrivial, 2 eggs, 1 fertilized, waiting for D3 to decide on PGD biopsy. Dr thinks it is my age issue, and give only 10% success rate for any future attempts.

I feel that IVF is not helping me much. Even with the strongest protocol, I did not produce many follicles/eggs. With this 2nd attempt, I was on stimulation meds for 15 days. It really hit my body hard, which make me wonder if those drugs really just work on your ovaries. To me they affect my whole body!! I am still in a lot of pain 4 days after the last dose.

Since I can ovulate on my own in natural cycles (sometimes release 2 eggs in 1 cycle), and had been easy to get pregnant naturally, we are thinking that maybe we should go back to the natural way of trying to get pregnant. If I miscarry, we will keep trying after recovery. At least there will be no drug involved. And I can just feel the pregnancy, even it will end up m/c. IVF does not increase egg quality, as Dr said. But in my case, it does not increase egg quatity neither.

If anybody has a successful story to go natural after all the IVF odds, we really appreciate. I read 1 successful story in this forum (thank you for sharing), but want to know more. I don't have time to read through the whole forum before I post this message. If there is anything similar, please excuse me for doing so. Thank you all for reading. Wish everybody reach their parenting dreams.

[teachertam]

Maggie,

I had 2 failed IVF attempts and and then got pregnant naturally while waiting to do a frozen cycle.

Our 1st attempt produced 3 eggs with 2 embies transferred. Our 2nd attempt produced 12 eggs. We fertilized 8, transferred 5 embies and froze 4 eggs. Eventhough, that last cycle seemed to be a winner, I did not get pregnant.

While we were waiting to proceed with our frozen cycle, I had an HSG x-ray. It is where they shoot dye through your fallopian tubes to see if there is a blockage. I did not have a blockage. My RE said that for some reason women have an increased chance of getting pregnant the cycles directly following this procedure. We did try to get pregnant right after the procedure. Luckily for us, I got pregnant. My RE and embryologist were amazed that I got pregnant naturally. I am almost 20 weeks pregnant with my first child.

Let me know if you have any additional questions for me.

Tammy

[maggie68]

Hi Tam,

Thank you very much for your reply. First of all, congratulations on your successful pregnancy! I read your story in the previous threads. Yours is the the one that I mentioned in my post. I wonder if there are other women out there who has successful stories to tell as well after failed IVFs. I am just hoping to get some confidence from other women who have been to similar situations. Have you read similar stories before in this message board?

There are also a couple of questions that I would like to ask you if you don't mind.
1. Can you pinpoint why you produced a lot more follicles/eggs in the 2nd IVF attempt than your 1st one? 11 eggs is very impressive compared to mine. I only got 3 even when I was 39. Any tricks how to keep ovaries young?
2. Have you been through any changes in terms of your natural periods before you got pregnant naturally? I noticed that since my 1st IVF attempt, my period has been getting shorter (from 5 day period to 3 day ones), and with less flow (sometimes even no obvious flow). I wonder if that is a sign that I am already too old to have a normal pregnancy using my own eggs. Am I at the stage of premature manopause? But other than the shorter and lighter periods, I don't have other symptoms yet. My periods are still regular. What do you think? I would like to ask this question to other ladies out there as well. What do you guys think?

I am trying to think positively, but sometimes it is very hard. I hope you understand and give me some encouragement. Wish everybody good luck with a lot of baby dust.

[maggie68]

Hi Tam,

Thank you very much for your reply. First of all, congratulations on your successful pregnancy! I read your story in the previous threads. Yours is the the one that I mentioned in my post. I wonder if there are other women out there who has successful stories to tell as well after failed IVFs. I am just hoping to get some confidence from other women who have been to similar situations. Have you read similar stories before in this message board?

There are also a couple of questions that I would like to ask you if you don't mind.
1. Can you pinpoint why you produced a lot more follicles/eggs in the 2nd IVF attempt than your 1st one? 12 eggs is very impressive compared to mine. I only got 3 even when I was 39. Any tricks how to keep ovaries young?
2. Have you been through any changes in terms of your natural periods before you got pregnant naturally? I noticed that since my 1st IVF attempt, my period has been getting shorter (from 5 day period to 3 day ones), and with less flow (sometimes even no obvious flow). I wonder if that is a sign that I am already too old to have a normal pregnancy using my own eggs. Am I at the stage of premature manopause? But other than the shorter and lighter periods, I don't have other symptoms yet. My periods are still regular. What do you think? I would like to ask this question to other ladies out there as well. What do you guys think?

I am trying to think positively, but sometimes it is very hard. I hope you understand and give me some encouragement. Wish everybody good luck with a lot of baby dust.

[CarolynB]

Maggie

I am not sure how much I can help - but may be a little. Read the post as I am 4-0 too so hear the clock ticking loudly every day. You have had such a hard time that I wanted to write to you even if I cannot be off too much help.

I wondered if you had considered acupuncture. I was very unsure until my best friend read an article about it increasing your chances by 15%. She read the day after I got my BFN so I took as a sign. They are able to support both ivf and trying naturally. I have found that it has 'improved' by AF - more red and less clots (sorry if tmi). My AF also seems shorter but not sure if this is acu or ivf cycle or the 2 ops I have had this year (hard to tell!)

I went to a acu who specialises in infertility. He is working on my womb lining but can work on egg quality too.

I have not done it ( because of ££) but another friend who is 42 has been working with a dietician to improve her egg quality. Pregnant now but ivf rather than natural.

Two ladies on the April-May thread (Dania and Jackie) both got natural BFPs after treatment but both are younger than either you or me.

The other thing to consider might be iui rather than ivf especially if you cycle on a regular basis?

My consultant has us trying naturally right now after op to open my tubes. No success yet. We are going back at the end of the month to see whether we can do another cycle of ivf as sick & tired of all the waiting.

Hope that this helps a little. We have to keep trying. The over 40s thread is an inspiration to me although clearly I am in denial as not yet posted there!

Lots of Luck
Carolyn xxx

[BevT]

Hi Maggie,

I wanted to post as your history is very similar to mine, although I am older than you (just turned 47! eek). I was told that my problem was my egg quality, always cycled regularly, have no problem GETTING pg, but never seemed to keep hold of them. After several m/c's including one T21 pg, I fell pg with my DD in Dec 2002, tragically she was born still in July 2003. After that we turned to IVF as I stupidly thought it was a sure fire thing and would supply me with lots of eggs to use. First cycle converted to IUI as I only produced 3 follies (2 of which were too small). The second cycle I had increased drugs (maximum they would allow) and produced 5 follies, 3 eggs collected, 2 fertilized but still unsuccessful. My age was very much against me and my clinic would not give me any more tmt cycles, so I turned to donor egg. Having had tmt this June (abroad!), I am now 22 weeks pg - praying hard and keeping everything crossed.

You are younger than I am, and although my pg in 2003 resulted in tragedy, I think what I am telling you all this for is to not give up hope just yet of a natural conception. I managed to get pg naturally at 43, it was just a tragic accident that we lost our precious little girl (cord accident). She was perfect in every way - so it is possible at your age.

Best of luck to you,
Bev xxx

[teachertam]

Maggie,

Both of my IVF protocols were identical. I took the same drugs and same dosage both times. My doctor said that sometimes your body reacts differently to the same protocol. I only got 3 eggs retrieved from my first IVF, but 12 on my 2nd IVF attempt. Maybe you would have better results the second time around.

My periods have been about that same. I normally have 5 day periods. Regarding premature menopause, what was your FSH level? FSH is an indicator of early menopause. My FSH was in the 7 - 7.5 range. If your FSH is elevated this could mean that you are getting closer to menopause. My doctor would not proceed with IVF if your FSH is too high.

Don't give up.

Tammy

[maggie68]

Hi girls, thank you all for your postings and comforting words. It means a lot to me. I really appreciate. I was very sick after the egg retrieval, with abdominal pain from the stimulation) and severe whole back pain (old problem), so I wouldn’t get to the computer as much as I wish. So please excuse me not to reply your posts sooner.

Carolyn, I tried once with acupuncture after my 1st IVF failure. It did not benefit me. I have back problems from 2 major injuries happened about 8 yrs ago, which resulted in a total of 6 herniated discs. It was the reason why I started to get pregnant so late. That acupuncture treatment somehow irritated my poor back, which left me with severe back pain for the next 2 wks. Since then, I have not gone to any acupuncture treatment. But I heard from other patients as well about doing it a month ahead of the scheduled IVF to increase egg quality or uterus lining. I am not against acupuncture in any way. It is just not for me. I wonder how many women at their reproductive ages have such a poor back as mine. Honestly, I do think that my herniated discs and poor back, in general, contribute to my bad egg quality and early ovarian failure (don't want to accept yet). So I have been working diligently in the past 1 yr to get my herniated discs back. Now I have 5 of them back, but there is still 1 out there causing numbness. I got impatient with the progress I made with my back (although it is a huge progress already, considering my long history) and got into my 2nd IVF attempt. Unfortunately, it ended up just as another failure.

BevT, I have been looking for women with similar histories as mine for a long time. Thank you for sharing your stories. I am really sorry that you lost your DD. I can’t even imagine how painful it could be to loss a precious baby at that stage, as a miscarriage is already quite devastated to a woman. You must be a very strong lady. I wish all the best to your current pregnancy and you will have a healthy baby in your arm soon. Thank you for your encouragement. We have decided to try on our own as soon as I recover from this failed IVF. We have not tried on our own since my 5th m/c in May 2005. After 2 IVF attempts, with enlarged ovaries and so on during the treatments, I don’t know if I can get pregnant as easy as before. We’ll keep fingers crossed for it. It seems to be the only advantage we had.

Tam, thank you for sharing your IVF details. My FSH levels were 7.9 and 7.6 in 2004 and 2005, not high at all. My Dr did not test it this time, as he said that some women just don’t have increased FSH even when they are getting close to menopause.

Baby dust to all of you ladies.

[maggie68]

Hi Bev,

If you don't mind me asking, did you have any chronic medical problem that could contribute to the egg quality other than just age? I am trying to find any evidence if my back problem is the main thing, although my dr think it is just the age. Thank you and good luck.

[BevT]

Hi Maggie, no I'm afraid it was just put down to maternal age. I have felt quite bitter about the fact that when I was late 20's, early 30's there was so much in the media about women having it all, i.e. career etc and having your children later, spouting off about women having children in the 40's that I thought I had plenty of time. I put off having a family as I wanted my career and had even been asked 20 yrs ago if I was wanting a family at an interview for my career advancement. I felt pressured into saying no, as I thought it might cost me my chance!!! When I finally thought at 38, yes I am ready now, my body said "too late"!

If only I had been "educated" earlier, I naively thought that so long as I was having regular periods (still am) I would be able to conceive and carry a baby to full term. I really do think that women should be better informed of the shelf life of our eggs from very early on, even perhaps when we first go to the GP for birth control - so we know what we are dealing with.

[maggie68]

Hi Bev, I sent you a private message, please check it out. Take care.