Poor Responder to stims -Success stories needed

KarenSmiff · Post by **KarenSmiff** » Wed Dec 10, 2003 4:57 pm

Hi everyone. havent posted on here for ages. Well, had three goes at ICSI last year, first go abandoned on long protocol, no response. Then second go on a short protocol, only 4 eggs/1 embryo - neg. Then 3rd go 5 eggies/3 embies, - neg. Having to start a brand new cycle each time. Next time will be begin of Feb. Feeling really anxious and depressed, but just prey that I make two good enough embies to put back. has anyone got any similar stories to myself? Went for our review today, and doctor showed us a chart with success rates on particular attempts, and with each one getting higher, (attempt 8 was 80% success rate!). But cant help thinking that this is a chart for "good" responders, but then again, it would include all kinds of different circumstances, egg donor/fet, etc wouldnt it? So nice to hear about all of the success stories, and I know that a lot of you have had your share of knock backs (slight under-statement). Good luck to EVERYONE. Karenx (me 30, dh 36 failed vas reversal).

Traci · Post by **Traci** » Wed Dec 10, 2003 10:38 pm

I'm afraid Karen that I am in exactly the same position as you so I cannot shed any light on this subject but just wanted to let you know that I know what you are feeling, we are going to see the consultant on the 18th so I will ask lots of questions . Me 36 soon to be 37 DH 46 with Vas Reversal 10% Motility 2 x icsi own eggs 1 x icsi donor eggs none frozen! Take care trace x

Trixie · Post by **Trixie** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 8:56 am

Hi Karen. I recently completed my first cycle of IVF/ICSI (negative)and was quite a poor responder (5 eggs). I found some postings on another message board that I sometimes visit suggesting that taking L-arginine can improve your response. It looked like it might be worth a try and I think I will give it a go next time. I'm too much of a luddite to know how to put a link through to the site in this message, but if you go to the bulletin board at www.care-ivf.com, there are two threads with relevant info on them, both started by Janine B, one on 4 December and one on 8 December. Good luck. Trixie.

KarenSmiff · Post by **KarenSmiff** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 10:50 am

Many thanks for your replies girls. Definately found the threads re: L'Arginine very interesting. Just baffles me as to why dont the Doctors mention anthing about it? Surely, if there is even a slight chance of producing 1 more egg for me, it would definately be worth it. Right, off to do some more surfing, to find more info, square eyes here i come! Karenx

sharoninsomerset · Post by **sharoninsomerset** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 12:55 pm

Karen, I think lots of people are like us. I've had 3 failed ivf's and each time I've only had 3 eggs all developing into embryos (with two being really good quality) - and this is the same everytime!! We have come to terms with this now and are just happy to get 2 good ones each time as that is all you really need at the end of the day. Like Traci I'm 36 will be 37 tomorrow!! and hubby will be 46 in Feb. The doctors have recommended assisted hatching for next time, if we go ahead to help implantation. I'll take a look at the L'Arginine as see what it is all about - anything that will help!! Hope everything goes well Love sharon xx

Zed2003 · Post by **Zed2003** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 6:29 pm

Hi Karen, Most of all we have to remember it only takes ONE egg and one sperm. I know it's hard, but so true. Like you, I don't respond very well, partly they think I have a lowish egg reserve, but if it helps: 1st IVF - about 5/6 follicles - 2 eggs, 1 put back - not pg 2nd IVF - about 4/5 follicles - 3 eggs, 2 put back - pg but m/c 3rd IVF - about 4 follicles - 2 eggs, 2 put back (although 1 dodgy!) - now 25 weeks pg with baby boy! (me 33, dh 35 trying 6 yrs, no obvious reason) Hope this gives you some encouragement... Zoe x

fiona_lk · Post by **fiona_lk** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 4:44 pm

Hi Karen, I like Zoe's reply so will base mine on hers (and not a lot to alter strangly enough) I also don't respond very well, but they have no idea why. 1st & 2nd donor IUI with ovulation induction 150 ml FSH - 1 follicle - not pg 1st ICSI (FSH 7.0 on 450ml stims, long protocol) - about 5/6 follicles - 3 eggs, 2 embies put back - not pg 2nd ICSI (FSH 7.2 on 450ml stims, long protocol) - about 5/6 follicles - 3 eggs, 2 embies put back - pg but ectopic 3rd ICSI (FSH 8.9 on 600ml stims, short protocol) - about 4 follicles - 3 eggs, 2 embies put back (although 1 dodgy like Zoe!) - now 25 weeks pg with baby boy Xander (spooky Zoe)! Me 36, dh 46 trying 5 yrs, male factor - 96% abnormal Hope this helps Love Fiona xxxx [Edited by fiona_lk on 12-Dec-03 08:46]

Traci · Post by **Traci** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 6:12 pm

Wow Fiona and Zoe you have both made my day Thanks for that Trace x

Zed2003 · Post by **Zed2003** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 9:29 pm

LOL Fiona, that's scary biscuits!! Great name by the way. Now we know the sex, we seem to have stopped talking about names!!!! Glad we made your day Trace! Zoe x

KarenSmiff · Post by **KarenSmiff** » Sun Dec 14, 2003 10:47 am

Excellent success stories girls.Many Thanks for your responses. Youve really perked me up now. IT IS POSSIBLE! Positive thinking back on track! Yippeeeeeeeeee kaz xxxx

sharoninsomerset · Post by **sharoninsomerset** » Fri Jan 23, 2004 1:52 pm

Karen,

Have you started your new cycle yet? Just wondering whether you had decided to take l-arginine or not? I've started my 4th ivf and started injecting on Wednesday, scans next wed and friday and EC on the 4th Feb. I started taking l-arginine 500mg when I started sniffing and i've upped the dose to 1000mg now i'm injecting - thinking of going up to 2000mg as I think in the studies they were using 2000mg or 3000mg? The studies don't seem to be conclusive but my thoughts are that its just an amino acid and hopefully can't do too much harm?

Anyway, I'll let you know from the scan if it's improved anything with follicle response next week.

Good luck with yours
Take care for now
Sx

LORI630 · Post by **LORI630** » Fri Jan 23, 2004 2:28 pm

My best friend's FSH has been 12 before, though it went down to 7 point something at the start of her recent IVF/ICSE cycle, during which she used the short protocol (she took bravelle). They got 4 eggs. 3 of them fertilised through ICSE (they did ICSE not because of male factor, but because there weren't large numbers of eggs). All embryos were good quality 7 or 8 cell. They put 3 back on day 3. She will be 40 in 3 weeks, and is 15 weeks pregnant with a baby girl. Good luck. Keep up your hope and spirits. Cycles vary so much even for one woman.

sharoninsomerset · Post by **sharoninsomerset** » Thu Jan 29, 2004 8:17 am

Hi everyone,

Just an update on the poor responder/L-arginine question. I just had my first scan after taking L-arginine for about 2 weeks - and no improvement!!

In fact one of the worst cycles (this is my 4th) I've got one folly at 13.5, one at 9, one at 7 and one at 5. So very low number and very small! We are still going ahead as it's not really unusual for me and I have caught up in size previously. Just have to wait now for Friday to see if they are any bigger.

I've got a free unopened bottle of L-arginine if anyone wants to have a go - I'll send it on (Holland & Barrett £3.99) for free. I might not have taken it for long enough or not high enough dose - who knows!.

Sx

Nikola · Post by **Nikola** » Thu Jan 29, 2004 10:07 am

I know I'm a bit late, but I just wanted to add that I have always had high FSH (10.6) and my last tmt I only managed 6 eggs of which 4 fertislised but were poor quality (grade 3 - 4 cell), I put two back and am pg with twins. So both my crappy embies decided to hang around. I hope this gives you all some hope and reassurance that it CAN work even with high FSH and poor quality/number of embies!

Good luck to you all.
love nikola.xx

Traci · Post by **Traci** » Thu Jan 29, 2004 3:19 pm

After 2 x poor responces and negatives but good graded embys plus 1 cycle of a donor egg (cousin) They are doing tests on blood clotting etc to see if its implantation , it should cost around £575 but the docs have covered it , cant wait for all the answeres , I am having 2 x FSH's done too to see if I can go for my own eggs , fingers crossed.

Trace x

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