Hello, I'm new to this whole message board business but have been posting on the 'Babies loved and lost' bit recently as my beloved baby girl (from ICSI #1) was stillborn at 35 weeks in March.
Trying to recover from the devastation around me I am looking at starting ICSI #2 soon and am terrified that getting pregnant the first time was just a fluke and that actually my responses to the first cycle weren't that great. Am I really as neurotic as my husband says and panicking for no reason?
I am 32 and produced 9 eggs on 3 amps Menopur, 7 were mature, 6 fertilised and we got 2 good embies (none for freezing). I got pregnant.
Everyone else seems to get millions of eggs and good embies and I'm worried my reaction is a sign of poor FSH or whatever that thing is and lack of response - also isn't your first cycle supposed to be your best response (do your ovaries get resistant?)
Can I get pregnant again or should I just give up now and buy 20 cats?
really nice to be in contact with you anyway
Anjela
x
New and Neurotic (and slightly insane)
Hello Anjela
Good girl for coming to this side of the board. Little steps - remember!
Firstly - No your ovaries do not become resistant after treatments. Your response looked about avarage to me. It's better to have quality not quantity with eggs. I have had 12, 12 and 15 and never had any to freeze either but fresh cycles are better anyway but I still would like to have had some frosties just for piece of mind if you get my drift.
This whole IVF thing is a lottery. You were very lucky to fall PG on your first attempt there is no reason that you can't do it again. You know and your doctors know that you can get PG which is the first hurdle that has been over come.
The second treatment will be fine as the doctors know how your body reacts to the drugs and you just have to be positive and have faith in your fertility team.
Be strong Anjela and take care.
Love Dagny xkx
Good girl for coming to this side of the board. Little steps - remember!
Firstly - No your ovaries do not become resistant after treatments. Your response looked about avarage to me. It's better to have quality not quantity with eggs. I have had 12, 12 and 15 and never had any to freeze either but fresh cycles are better anyway but I still would like to have had some frosties just for piece of mind if you get my drift.
This whole IVF thing is a lottery. You were very lucky to fall PG on your first attempt there is no reason that you can't do it again. You know and your doctors know that you can get PG which is the first hurdle that has been over come.
The second treatment will be fine as the doctors know how your body reacts to the drugs and you just have to be positive and have faith in your fertility team.
Be strong Anjela and take care.
Love Dagny xkx
Me 38 DH 40
1st 2nd & 4th IVF/ICSI -ve
3rd +ve DD Katelyn born @ 24wks & sadly died
5th +ve m/c 9wks
6th +ve Twins Sadly DD Leah stillborn @20wks and DS Kieran born @22wks but sadly died too
7th +ve - DD Chloë Mae born @38wks our precious miracle
1st 2nd & 4th IVF/ICSI -ve
3rd +ve DD Katelyn born @ 24wks & sadly died
5th +ve m/c 9wks
6th +ve Twins Sadly DD Leah stillborn @20wks and DS Kieran born @22wks but sadly died too
7th +ve - DD Chloë Mae born @38wks our precious miracle
Anjela
Just wanted to echo Dagny's thought really. You know mine having already rammed them down your throat on the other board!!! Sorry!
Your response is fine - yes it could be better I am not lying but it is down to quality like Dagny says and there is nothing to say they might not get it better this time - not everything has to get worse you know!
Mind over matter - you can do this and you have done it already - you were dealt a nasty hand but go out there and get a flush - good luck
Love
Tracey
xxx
Just wanted to echo Dagny's thought really. You know mine having already rammed them down your throat on the other board!!! Sorry!
Your response is fine - yes it could be better I am not lying but it is down to quality like Dagny says and there is nothing to say they might not get it better this time - not everything has to get worse you know!
Mind over matter - you can do this and you have done it already - you were dealt a nasty hand but go out there and get a flush - good luck
Love
Tracey
xxx
ttc 9 years. 38 yrs old, dh 8 hrs younger!First IVF in Aug 2002 and had ectopic.2nd IVF neg.3rd FET and negative.4th FET and positive but sadly lost our little boy at 20 weeks.5th FET and Alice Isobel and Emily Charlotte born 5th Aug 2004!
Hi Anjela
Unlike Dagny, I'm still paddling in the shallows and deciding whether to go ahead with attempt no 1, so I don't know about numbers of eggs and embies, etc. But the main thing to remember is that you only actually need ONE good embie to have a baby. I know you're chances are higher if you've got a few but they're only going to put 2 back anyway.
I hadn't heard that the first attempt was likely to be the best one - I always thought of it as a kind of "practice run". If you're really lucky you get pregnant and if not, then they can fine tune the treatment next time, so I would have thought you'd have a better chance (or at least the same), not worse on the second attempt. Also, I've heard of a few people who've had one child through IVF and then gone back to have a second one and been successful, so I doubt if it's "one strike and you're out".
Also you are still quite young - I think I'm allowed to panic cos I'm 10 years older than you and people on this board tell me not to give up! Having said that, I think your feelings are completely natural and you're not neurotic at all. IVF is a big thing at the best of times and you've just suffered a major bereavement. You must have been through a horrible time and I imagine you're still feeling pretty raw. Are you sure you're ready to try again yet? If someone conceived naturally and then had a stillbirth I wonder how long they'd leave it before trying again - maybe more than a few months. I haven't been through it, so I don't know and I'm sure there are other people on the board who sadly have been through the same thing and would have better advice, but all I'm saying is make sure you give yourself enough time to recover, physically and emotionally, before you take it on again.
Wish you loads of luck with it all
Caroline
ps whatever happens there is no excuse for having 20 cats! (not a cat lover)
Unlike Dagny, I'm still paddling in the shallows and deciding whether to go ahead with attempt no 1, so I don't know about numbers of eggs and embies, etc. But the main thing to remember is that you only actually need ONE good embie to have a baby. I know you're chances are higher if you've got a few but they're only going to put 2 back anyway.
I hadn't heard that the first attempt was likely to be the best one - I always thought of it as a kind of "practice run". If you're really lucky you get pregnant and if not, then they can fine tune the treatment next time, so I would have thought you'd have a better chance (or at least the same), not worse on the second attempt. Also, I've heard of a few people who've had one child through IVF and then gone back to have a second one and been successful, so I doubt if it's "one strike and you're out".
Also you are still quite young - I think I'm allowed to panic cos I'm 10 years older than you and people on this board tell me not to give up! Having said that, I think your feelings are completely natural and you're not neurotic at all. IVF is a big thing at the best of times and you've just suffered a major bereavement. You must have been through a horrible time and I imagine you're still feeling pretty raw. Are you sure you're ready to try again yet? If someone conceived naturally and then had a stillbirth I wonder how long they'd leave it before trying again - maybe more than a few months. I haven't been through it, so I don't know and I'm sure there are other people on the board who sadly have been through the same thing and would have better advice, but all I'm saying is make sure you give yourself enough time to recover, physically and emotionally, before you take it on again.
Wish you loads of luck with it all
Caroline
ps whatever happens there is no excuse for having 20 cats! (not a cat lover)
Hi Anjela
I'm sorry to hear about your daughter - I read your posts on the Babies Loved and Lost boards but didn't feel I could reply there.
I can, however, reply to your concerns about number of eggs/embryos. I was told that the first cycle is definitely an experiment as far as the drugs go. I only produced 6 eggs, of which 3 fertilised. My clinic said that for my next go they would have increased the drugs to up the number of eggs produced. But as it was, we didn't need a second cycle because the 2 embies that we had put back in both implanted and produced my (now 2 year old) twins. We were lucky that all 3 embryos produced were Grade 1 but we had already decided not to freeze any so it didn't matter that we didn't get enough embryos to freeze.
As Caroline says, you are still relatively young so there is no reason why ICSI can't work for you again. Wishing you all the best.
Jules
I'm sorry to hear about your daughter - I read your posts on the Babies Loved and Lost boards but didn't feel I could reply there.
I can, however, reply to your concerns about number of eggs/embryos. I was told that the first cycle is definitely an experiment as far as the drugs go. I only produced 6 eggs, of which 3 fertilised. My clinic said that for my next go they would have increased the drugs to up the number of eggs produced. But as it was, we didn't need a second cycle because the 2 embies that we had put back in both implanted and produced my (now 2 year old) twins. We were lucky that all 3 embryos produced were Grade 1 but we had already decided not to freeze any so it didn't matter that we didn't get enough embryos to freeze.
As Caroline says, you are still relatively young so there is no reason why ICSI can't work for you again. Wishing you all the best.
Jules
TTC 5 years. Daniel & Charlotte born 22.03.02, 1st ICSI treatment. TTC for 4 further years. 2nd ICSI cycle abandoned, 3rd cycle BFN. Looking forward to being a happy family of 4.
always thinking worst case
Thanks for the advice all - Tracey, you are right that I am constantly thinking about the worse case scenario and how things might get even more horrid, but maybe things can get better as well?!
Caroline, I think I would probably take more time before concieving if I knew we could do it naturally. We have been through a nightmare - but the thought of starting IVF again is weighing so heavily on my mind that the anticipation is starting to become more frightening than the reality (I hope anyway!) I think I need to throw myself into something forward looking and positive. I know that it will be tough, but nothing can be as difficult or dark as the place I have just been.
I am sorry to sound to completely neurotic and panicky, it is just that I have suddenly become aware of all these hurdles and pitfalls in the IVF world that never existed before. Oh I wish I could have my IVF ignorance back! Wish there was a pill I could take that would make me instantly preggers.
I'll take the advice about the cats though
Thank you!
A
x
Caroline, I think I would probably take more time before concieving if I knew we could do it naturally. We have been through a nightmare - but the thought of starting IVF again is weighing so heavily on my mind that the anticipation is starting to become more frightening than the reality (I hope anyway!) I think I need to throw myself into something forward looking and positive. I know that it will be tough, but nothing can be as difficult or dark as the place I have just been.
I am sorry to sound to completely neurotic and panicky, it is just that I have suddenly become aware of all these hurdles and pitfalls in the IVF world that never existed before. Oh I wish I could have my IVF ignorance back! Wish there was a pill I could take that would make me instantly preggers.
I'll take the advice about the cats though
Thank you!
A
x
Jules
Knew you would come up trumps!
Anjela - don't worry you sound no more neurotic than the rest of us - not sure that's a help.
Oliver died in the September and I had my FET in the November AF - which was early November!
As long as mentally you can do it then no reason after 6 weeks when the body has returned to sort of normal!
good luck
Love
Tracey
xxx
PS let us know if you find any of those pills!
Knew you would come up trumps!
Anjela - don't worry you sound no more neurotic than the rest of us - not sure that's a help.
Oliver died in the September and I had my FET in the November AF - which was early November!
As long as mentally you can do it then no reason after 6 weeks when the body has returned to sort of normal!
good luck
Love
Tracey
xxx
PS let us know if you find any of those pills!
ttc 9 years. 38 yrs old, dh 8 hrs younger!First IVF in Aug 2002 and had ectopic.2nd IVF neg.3rd FET and negative.4th FET and positive but sadly lost our little boy at 20 weeks.5th FET and Alice Isobel and Emily Charlotte born 5th Aug 2004!
Hi there
Just to say - welcome! Your numbers sounds completely average and I wouldnt worry at all - ha ha, I know thats impossible - but seriously, you response sounds good!! Second time should be the same or possibily even better as they will have a record of how you reacted to the drugs last time
I think you must be incredibly brave to have gone through what you have experienced. And I'm sure you know you must deserve to have your wished come true this time
We will be watching out for you!!
Cazxx
Just to say - welcome! Your numbers sounds completely average and I wouldnt worry at all - ha ha, I know thats impossible - but seriously, you response sounds good!! Second time should be the same or possibily even better as they will have a record of how you reacted to the drugs last time
I think you must be incredibly brave to have gone through what you have experienced. And I'm sure you know you must deserve to have your wished come true this time
We will be watching out for you!!
Cazxx
anjela, i realy cant imagine what u have gone thru over the last couple
of months, the pain must be very hard, everyone deals with things
differently and i can undestand u feel the way forward is to focus
on your next treatment, only u know when that time is right.
I will join in with the other girls in response to your concern over
the amount of eggs u produced, the first time is alway a kind of
trial run for the clinics as they have to find out how u respond
to treatment, there are so may options they can do, increase
dosage, change medication, but its quality not quantity, and i think
u have proved that, and also a good indication was the fact
it worked for you first time.
As for the cats.........do both
alisonnxx (cat lover)
of months, the pain must be very hard, everyone deals with things
differently and i can undestand u feel the way forward is to focus
on your next treatment, only u know when that time is right.
I will join in with the other girls in response to your concern over
the amount of eggs u produced, the first time is alway a kind of
trial run for the clinics as they have to find out how u respond
to treatment, there are so may options they can do, increase
dosage, change medication, but its quality not quantity, and i think
u have proved that, and also a good indication was the fact
it worked for you first time.
As for the cats.........do both
alisonnxx (cat lover)