Staci

[danica]

hi staci,
remember, it only takes one embryo to work.. i can imagine how you're feeling though - i get like u as well as im sure many women and partners do too... im sorry your feeling so down but want u to know that we're all here for u... i hope everything goes to plan - whats your actual test date? lots of positive vibes sent your way!
luv, d

[ogr1]

what clinic are you at?

they should have been able to answer your questions better then that.

we pay alot of money and put our hearts and souls into ivf at least they could give us time to answer all of your questions and concerns
but to give you some hope our embies wernt very good and the first time we got pregnant with our twins and the second time we got pregnant with our son..
and no none of them survied but it wasnt because of them. they where all very healthy. it was me not being able to carry them..
so low grade does make it...
and now you are on the hard part the 2 wk wait
becky

[Mia]

Staci,

I knew you would be stressing. I am not so sure "that one was a "2 PN"" makes sense to me.
I too am very worried about the post-thaw quality of my embryos, so I have read a bit about how they grade embryos post-thaw to determine survival. I have access to a medical library, so my research includes medical journal and of course the internet, like you.

It is my understanding that if a certain percentage of the cells are dead then the embryo is not viable. It does not make sense to me that a blastocyst with 80- 120 cells with a cell mass and a trophectoderm could possibly be a 2PN (single cell). I am not saying that you are wrong it just doesn't make any logical sense. Here is a site that has a message board where you can ask question to "experts"-RE specialist.

http://www.inciid.org/

You might want to ask about the statement your clinic made. If you do, let me know if such a thing is possible, i.e. a blastocyst losing all its cells but one and still being transfered.

Did your clinic say anything about the blastocysts expanding?----a possible good sign. I am assuming they did if they were cultured for an extra day.

Concerning your clinic----I am in a similiar position. My clinic was brand new, I was their second patient!!!! The embryologist is my age, and the RE come from a clinic with a poor success rate. I don't feel like I was given all the screening tests, they didn't use ultrasound-guided transfer, and I can go on and on.

Regardless, try to relax. Read a book, go shopping, anything but research IVF on the computer ( you have read most everything already ).

Mia

[AMITHIS]

Danica,

My actual test date is Feb. 11 .... but I'll probably give in to hpt's long before that (just so I can torment myself even more!).

Becky,

The clinic I go is really the only one in Orlando, FL. It's suposed to be a decent enough clinic and they've been around since the 1980's. I seem to recall their stats looked ok. Overall, the staff is pleasant enough. I don't really know what to think. It's just that, even when I do ask questions, it seems like I consistently don't get staightforward answers. I mean how pathetic is it that I don't even know if I actually had a morula and 2 early blasts or something other than that transferred? Another thing that happened this time was, they don't allow husbands in the room for the transfer like some clinics do but they have a screen in another room where DH is supposed to be able to watch the ultrasound view of what is happening. Apparently, the screen didn't work this time and, when he told the Dr. after the fact that he couldn't watch it, she just said "oh, it was nothing." (maybe to her!)

They also seem to go with the standard protocols for everyone without taking individual issues into account. For example, my cycle was canceled back in Aug. due to the formation of cysts while downregging. They didn't consider the long cycles that I have and they started me downregging just prior to when I normally ovulate. This is known to cause cysts. The whole problem could have been avoided if they had just given me bcp's before the cycle. For this cycle I insisted on them and everything went smoothly. Anyway, obviously I could go on and on. My DH says that, if we manage to get a +ive, it will be in spite of them; not because of them.

I kind of wish I had travelled to one of of the Sher Institute locations when I did the IVF but it just seemed really difficult to do IVF away from home....not to mention the addtional costs involved of hotels, food, etc.

Thanks for telling me about your embies implanting even though they were lower grade. Stories like that do make me feel like there might still be a little hope here!

Staci

[Paige]

Staci!

I'm so happy everything made the thaw. Good for you. Take it easy for these 2 weeks, my clinic said absolutely no jogging, volleyball or weight training.
If I have any advise, it would be to stay away from the hpt's. I took one the day before my blood test and it was a big fat negative. For approx. 24 hours I was a royal b**ch. Then the clinic called the next day with a bfp! My clinic did the blood test on day 10...so of course day 9 was too early for an hpt. But still the hpt sent me spiralling downward.
Take it easy, and try to stay positive. Welcome to the year long 2 WW! Wishing your success.


Paige

[julesg]

Staci

Well done at getting to ET - I hope that you are feeling ok - try and stay away from the HPT

I will be really pleased if I can get to ET this time

Good luck for the 11th

After my last cycle was abandoned I stayed away from the site for a while so it is taking me ages to catch up.

Love and hugs
Julie

[danica]

staci, dont torment yourself!! aarrgghh the dreaded HPT, my specialist hates them and keeps telling everyone theyre not accurate at all... my sister was pregnant and she had done 2 HPT that both gave a BFN so try to stay away if u can
hope you're doing ok, your clinic/staff dont sound the best but hey, its done now and all u can do is stay positive... here's to a BFP on the 11th!! not too far away now, so rest and be pampered! take care,
d xo

[AMITHIS]

Mia,

It is probably a good thing I don't have access to a medical library. My DH would never see me again!

Thanks for the link. I will check it out.

Maybe the Dr. was actually telling the truth when she said the 2PN thing didn't really mean anything; that it was just some sort of code their lab used. You wouldn't think the lab would use something that universally just happens to stand for something else though, would you?!

If this fails, the clinic will have to provide me with a written explanation of why they think it might not have worked. I will wait and see if they bring up any issues relating to embryo quality then. If not, I'll make sure I ask them. At this point in time, I just figure what's done is done and getting additional information from them won't really help. I have very little hope of this working anyway so it's not like I have my hopes up too much. The embryos were frozen as morulas on Day 5 so I'm not sure how many cells they had at that time. I just know that none of them had even made it to expanded blasts at the time of transfer. At least one was an early blast. I have to think such slow development is a very bad sign.

Anyway....

In other non-IVF news, we have had a deposit down with a collie breeder for some time for a puppy. A litter was born on Christmas Day and we are going to see the puppies on Sunday. I don't think they'll be ready to take home for a few more weeks. DH and I have really been struggling over this one because we have 2 cats (4 and 5 years old) who are just great and get along perfectly together. We're just a bit nervous that bringing a dog into the mix will completely destroy their temperments and make them destructive. We keep changing our minds every other day about whether to get the puppy or not. I have a feeling that, once I see them on Sunday, all caution will probably be thrown out the door though. Just what I need. Something else to stress about!!

How are things going with you?

Staci

[Mia]

Hi Staci,

I wish you could be more positive, but I understand your need of 'not getting your hopes up".

I didn't mean to sound like "little miss know it all" when I replied to your message. I suppose I am very interested in your "case" because my embryos are also a day behind in development. My clinic allowed my embryos to culture an extra day and froze them on day six. So, I am unsure how much information we will know before they our transfered. I am assuming we will thaw and transfer on the same day....and not be given the options you guys were given.

On the upside I was told one of the frosties looked better than the one embryo I transfered. When the RE told me this I was confused because when I was lying upside down after transfer he was showing me where the one they had just transfered was begining to hatch. You can get better than that???

Of course, my pessimistic side tells me that what this really means is that two of the frosties do not look as healthy as the one that didn't implant last summer.

All the drama!!!!!!!

Even with all the research I do, I have never asked about the quality of my embryos. I suppose there is a part of me that does not want to know that type of information on a personal level ( I would rather rely on clinical studies and statistics).

I don't think it would matter what I was told. I would worry regardless.

I think the 2PN statement is confusing, but if the RE said something like this to me I doubt I would ask any questions, but then I would do my research online.......and worry!

I am on my way to get a haircut. Good luck with the puppy. We have a couple of cats also, and I want puppy. I have yet been able to get my husband to agree.

Mia

And now since we are talking about pets I am going to ask a silly question.
One of my cats is 20-25lbs. The day after transfer ( less than 18 hours after transfer). This fat cat jumped down from the dresser directly on the lower part of my stomach. The force of the blow made me double over.

Okay, I know I am being neurotic but I consider you all experts. Does anyone think this could have had some kind of an effect on that cycle not working out? I mean what would your feeling be if this had happened to you?
I know all the guidelines we are given, but my thinking was that once the embryos are in the uterus they were relatively safe from outside influences.

Mia

Mia

[AMITHIS]

Hi Mia,

I think your embryos are actually in better shape than mine from the start because they actually all had made it to blast. At the time I did my fresh IVF, we had agreed with the clinic that they would let the remaining embryos go to Day 6 then freeze whatever made it to blast. Well, for some reason (which I still don't fully understand), they ended up going ahead and freezing them on Day 5 as morulae instead. From what I gathered, they were afraid they'd start hatching that night and be too far developed by the next day (you would think they'd have at least one embryologist on shift during the night to handle such matters?).

With Day 6 blasts, they would probably thaw them out the same morning.
I don't see there would be a point of taking them an additional day? They are already where you want them to be....
I read on a question and answer forum with an embryologist that Day 6 blasts are only slight less likely to implant than Day 5 blasts. I think the comparison he made was a matter of a very small percentage difference between the two (I think it was 4%). That would be encouraging to me if any of mind had actually made it to full fledged blasts at the time of transfer!! !

I gave in and took a HPT today (5 dpt) and, of course, it was negative.
Why do I do this to myself?

Regarding the puppy, my DH isn't totally keen on the idea either. He agrees as long as it's understood that he doesn't have the time to take care of it so it's my responsibility (i.e. if the puppy destroys all our new furniture and makes the cats miserable then it's my fault).

In all honesty, I don't think the cat jumping on your stomach would have had any effect on your outcome. Just think what a sparsely populated place the world would be if such things could prevent a pregnancy from happening. I mean the embryos were very well protected and something like that wouldn't be able to knock them loose. I look back on things that happened or things that I did during my first cycle too and wonder if I messed it up somehow (like by walking briskly on the treadmill 4 dpt) but then I try to force myself to be rational about the whole thing.

Anyway, time to get off the computer and try to do something distracting (or maybe even productive) for a few hours!

Staci

[wendy30]

Hi Staci

Just wanted to say hi & wish you luck with your 2ww. I know its hard to be positive or even to be negative sometimes but I like to go with that after the ET I'm pregnant until someone tells me I'm not.

Try to be patient, it may be worth the 2ww, find yourself a good book and try and take your mind of HPTs.

Love

Wendy

[DebraP]

Staci...

you poor little worrier We'll have to all work together to help distract you through this 2ww. You're off to a better start than my last tmt, they didn't make it through defrosting at all...so your guys are already strong enough to survive a difficult stage - and that's before the 2ww begins.

What do you have planned to help distract you? the puppy would certainly count but I'm not a dog person so won't breathe a word of comment on this DH washing his hands of it doesn't sound good though, from what I've heard, new puppies are very demanding, can be destructive, messy, leave little presents in corners etc. I know they're also adorable, loving and fun....tricky equation, esp. with the cats.

Keep posting and keep smiling - this needs to be a positive and enjoyable start to your pg please

love
Debra.

[Paige]

Staci:

Good luck with your puppy decision. My only suggestion is to know whether you want one or not prior to going to the breeder, because there is nothing more sweet than a furry little puppy. My friend has a Collie and they love love love it, but could do without the blowing of the coat 2xs per year. I have 2 dogs, but neither blow their coats, and one is a great jogging partner.

Mia: My little dog (20 lbs) did the same thing to me on my 2WW. She was sitting on my lap and decided to climb me to sit on top of the couch and totally jumped right on my stomach. My cycle worked out, so I wouldn't worry about it. Also, prior to knowing I was pregnant with my first I was at a wedding at Disney World and rode every ride that said "expectant mother should not ride", came home from the trip...realized I was late and took an hpt and it was +. I think once they are in there...they will either implant or not and you'd really have to do some crazy stuff in order to compromise one that was going to implant.

Best of Luck to you both,

Paige

[Kel]

Hi Staci!

WOW can't believe you are just one week away from TEST DAY!!!!!!!!!!!!! I think I must have got caught in a time loop somewhere!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Your lovely blast embies sound great!! All sounding very very positive to me!!!!

How is the 2ww going?? Have you got a stock of DVDs lined up?? Hope the next week can hurry up for you, I'll will it along for you!!

Loads of luck for the 11th!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (of before if you do some naughty testing! )

Love Kel xx

[AMITHIS]

Hey Kel,

So glad you're ok!

Already did the naughty testing (at least I waited to start until 5dpt instead of 4 like with my IVF).

I sent you a PM with the whole update.

Staci