Anyone doing a "flare"

[birdie]

I am due to begin my second IVF cycle next week. For my first one, 6 eggs were retrieved, 4 fertilized, and 3 were transferred but none implanted. We are trying a new clinic this time and they are doing a "flare" where I will be taking a microdose of Lupron while simultaneously taking the stim meds. It is an agressive plan but hopefully it will allow me to produce more eggs to maximize my chances of becoming pregnant.
I know that this is only my second attempt but I'm feeling so depressed and apprehensive about it. I am dreading the 2 week wait because that was the most trying time for me during my last cycle. I'm really lucky because I have a very supportive husband who has encouraged me to take the summer off just to focus on IVF and is willing to give this a go for as long as it takes. I wish I could be more positive about this but I find myself feeling resentful of all the people I see who have become pregnant naturally. I know if I compare myself to other people I'm only setting myself up for disappointment. I know there are a ton of women out there who are in my shoes and that's why I joined this message board. I'm hoping it will make me feel a little more secure in what I'm undertaking and help me not to feel so alone.

[jenniferdp]

I am actually starting to stim tomorrow. They have me on a "flare" protocol, too. So I take Microdose Lupron AM/AM Thursday and Friday and continue with the MDL Saturday and Sunday while also implementing Follistim and Menopur in the PM too. Monday is my next Blood test/Sonogram. They will call me today and let me know what my FSH and E2 levels are. Looks like I will stim until the 28th and take my HCG injection on the 29th with a retrieval on the 7/31st! FINGERS CROSSED that we get lots of great follies to grow.

This is my 4th IVF attempt but 2nd "flare" attempt. I am currently at CRMI - New York, but did my first first "flare" at RMA. I produced a whopping 15 eggs and 12 fertilized, unfortunately they only put back in 3 and none implanted. This time at CRMI, I also had a co-culture done and I have been doing accupuncture for about 5 months. Hopefully, all of these combined will prove lucky for us.

[birdie]

Good luck with your current cycle. I was wondering if you were able to freeze any embryos with all the eggs that you got previously? Also, what is a co-culture? I've never heard that term before.
Being that this is your 4th cycle, how long do you allow between cycles? My first one was in Feb. and so I waited quite some time to do my next one. I've heard of some women going right into a new cycle after a failed attempt though
Once again, I wish you success with this cycle and thank you for responding to my post.

[Ghost]

Also, what is a co-culture? I've never heard that term before.

I can answer that, if you don't mind. In IVF, co-culture refers to culturing human embryos along with other biological cells believed to help them chemically. Those I've heard of used kidney cells from African green monkeys.

[babygurlsolages]

What exactly is a flare? This is my second cycle and I think I was on the max of meds gonal f 300 2x a day and menopur 150 2x a day this time around. Only produced 4 eggs for first cycle. 2 were grade 1 which didnt implant. 4 eggs for second cycle which only 1 fertilized properly. Currently in 2WW. What will make me produce more eggs?

[courtney]

Birdie- I am a success story using the flare protocol!! We used this protocol on our first attempt. We retrieved 5 eggs, all 5 fertilized, two were transferred...and we are now 14 weeks pregnant with twins. In reading what seems like 1000s of posts from women using this protocol, the number of eggs didnt necessarily increase, but the egg quality was better. We 3dt, 2 8 cell Grade 2. If you have any questions, feel free to ask. Good luck!

[birdie]

Courtney, first let me say congratulations on your success! It's always encouraging to hear these types of stories.
How does a flare increase egg quality though? I would think if you've got good quality eggs that's more a reflection of your reserve, not the drugs or method used. The three eggs that they implanted on my first cycle were all good quality - 2 grade 1 and 1 grade 2. They just never implanted. I've been reading that a flare protocol is often used when a woman is 37 or older and I am 37. When I did my last cycle, I was still 36 so perhaps that's the reason they chose not to do a flare. It was a judgement call and I realize they never know how a woman will respond to the meds until she takes them.
I'm trying to remain cautiously optimistic about my upcoming cycle. I'm so nervous. I know very little is in my control and I just need to let what's going to happen happen. It's hard knowing that there's not a whole lot you can do but put your faith in what's meant to be.

[jenniferdp]

Hi Birdie,

Not to correct Ghost, but the co-culture that I am having is this: the cycle prior to this when I surged I went to CRMI and my doctor scraped the inside of my endometrial lining gathering cells, they also took 6 GIGANTIC viles of blood from me in which they separate the blood from Plasma. The reason behind this is when they fetilize the embryos in the petri dish that the emmbies get all the nutrients from MY body rather than from the generic cells that they currenly use. They say this may help strengthen the embryos and help with implantation, since they are coming from me implanting into me may be easier - does that make sense?

Also, I was not able to freeze any eggs so this is a total new cycle for me. I waited about 6 months in between #3 and #4 b/c I just felt that my body was stuck in "no" mode.

[kbear4211]

I am also a success story for the flare protocol. My first cycle, I got 6 eggs, only 4 mature, and two fertilized. We implanted the two, but got a BFN. I found out later, they were only medium grade.

My second cycle was a Microdose Lupron flare protocol. I was very disappointed that I was only getting about the same amount of follicles as the first time. Again, I only got 6 eggs at ER, and I was very sad. But, then we discovered the next day, that all were mature, and 5 fertilized. We implanted 4 (due to my age, 40) and the remaining embryo was watched until it reached blast on day 6 and was frozen.

Thank heavens, we were blessed with a BFP and I am now pregnant with one little girl.

I truly believe the flare protocol along w/ acupuncture helped with the quality of my eggs the second time around.

I wish you all the luck in the world. Remember PMA is important, although not easy, especially during the horrible 2ww.

Kris

[Ghost]

Hi Birdie,

Not to correct Ghost, but the co-culture that I am having is this: the cycle prior to this when I surged I went to CRMI and my doctor scraped the inside of my endometrial lining gathering cells, they also took 6 GIGANTIC viles of blood from me in which they separate the blood from Plasma. The reason behind this is when they fetilize the embryos in the petri dish that the emmbies get all the nutrients from MY body rather than from the generic cells that they currenly use. They say this may help strengthen the embryos and help with implantation, since they are coming from me implanting into me may be easier - does that make sense?

Makes sense to me. I always thought it was weird to use Vero cells from African monkeys.

[jenniferdp]

If that was the case, I would pply pass on the procedure - that would freak me out

Thanks, Ghost!

[Ghost]

Birdie- I am a success story using the flare protocol!! We used this protocol on our first attempt. We retrieved 5 eggs, all 5 fertilized, two were transferred...and we are now 14 weeks pregnant with twins. In reading what seems like 1000s of posts from women using this protocol, the number of eggs didnt necessarily increase, but the egg quality was better. We 3dt, 2 8 cell Grade 2. If you have any questions, feel free to ask. Good luck!

That FSH (Gona F, Manopur, Bravelle, Follistim, etc) is expensive. But your body has a ready supply. It would make sense to use what you have before buying more, right?

That's what a flare cycle does.

Lupron, and any drug in the same class (GnRH agonists) can be used in either of two different ways. When you first take it, it stimulates the pituitary to release FSH (and LH). After a few days of taking it, it shuts the pituitary down. The latter effect is the one most cycles are based on, but the first effect is the one the flare protocols depend on. So, in a flare cycle, you use Lupron to start your stimulation, rather than several days before, and the surge of FSH (and LH) from this gets your follicles developing.

Multiple reports say this is a good protocol for low responders.

[MommaKK]

Hi all,

Congrats to those who are on their way.

I just finished my first failed IVF - and it looks like I was on the most agressive treatmetn - microdose with shots am and pm of lupron and follistem/medapur.

We got 6 eggs, 4 matured, 1 made it to embryo stage for a day 3 transfer - 8 cell, grade 4. After the tww we are a no go.

My doctor is not encouraging - although we haven't had our follow up meeting yet (scheduled for Aug. 5).

I'm very discouraged - and wondering which way to go now.... try again? try another clinic? try egg donor? I'm every hopeful, but unwilling to be unrealistic.

I'd appreciate any suggestions.

thanks

[SueQiwi]

Hiya Birdie~ I am on a microdose flare protcol and going for IVF number 2 in August/ September. My Doc put me on the flare due to my high FSH level (12.9!) as they suspected I may have ovarian dysfunction and low reserve. (Do you knwo your FSH level?) He feared they wouldnt get any viable eggs at all with my high number.

However--the flare protcol worked like a charm and I produced 4 eggs, ALL of which fertilized and ALL of which divded proeprly. So I ended up with 4 viable embryos in the end--not bad for a girl with such high FSH! Even though none of them implanted--the Doc says my odds are just as good as a younger woman with low FSH. So I would be excited for the flare protocol--it also uses fewer meds (cheaper) and is quicker! Please do not feel alone--there are so many of us in your same position. Please keep us posted.

Courtney~I remember following your story on the March/April thread and you were an inspiration to me! I am so happy to hear the twins are coming along--take care.

[birdie]

Thanks everyone for your encouraging responses. It does help to know there are women out there going through what I am experiencing now. These past few days have been hard with the anticipation of my next cycle and also the news that not only are both my cousins pregnant naturally (all three of us were trying at the same time) but one of my good friends who just got married is expecting a baby with his wife, conceived during the honeymoon no less! I've decided I just need to isolate myself from the outside baby-making world for now (including no more Discovery Health programs) at least until my cycle is over. I can't let anything rattle me while I try to keep a positive outlook. Once again, it is so nice to know there are ladies on this board who have been there and "get it". Thank you so much!